UESPWiki:Deletion Review/Oblivion:Roleplaying/Gravedigger

This is an archive of past UESPWiki:Deletion Review discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links.

Oblivion:Roleplaying/Gravedigger

The activities proposed are mostly not possible in game and do not contribute to actually playing the game. Also, deletion is acceptable to the page's original creator. Nevertheless, as previously pointed out, a deletion review is necessary before deleting the page because the deletion has previously been contested. --Nephele^Talk 12:01, 28 September 2008 (EDT)

The following is all of the previous discussion about this page's deletion (moved here from the talk page, so that the reasons for deleting this article are preserved after the page is deleted):

Previously the reason given for Pro Deletion, within that tag:

" Mostly not possible in game - you can't actually dig holes, bury bodies, "get a suit", "bow your head", "appear to be counting", or much of anything else in here. (And how do you get undead to attack the graveyard at midnight?) The rest just amounts to "hang around the graveyard and do basically nothing". Pointless."

And the author's reasoning against, added to the tag:

"- Perhaps anyone else could care to contribute something other than cynicism. Maybe the imagination of the common roleplayer could manage something other than "hang around in the graveyard and do basically nothing." Or, maybe this is a stub of an idiot's idea and it should be deleted."

Reiteration of author's reasoning against, posted on this Discussion page:

"Get a suit-looking outfit , Burgundy linens. Summon undead or make them through the console. Keep the camera down. Roleplay. Gawd, the cynicism of some people. Honestly, hostility is not the answer to everything. Especially not on the topic of roleplaying."

Is this piece useful because it is entertaining, not useful because it isn't entertaining, or to be deleted because it isn't useful to non roleplayers? All PoV, but the last is a particularly counterproductive PoV to take when discussing a RPG.

It has helped the article to clarify which of the activities described are pure roleplaying and which are products of existing game props, locations, activities, etc.

Pro D tag removed. Steps have been taken to clarify the article. Primarily though the reason for removal is that the pro d author demonstrated clearly, an unfamiliarity with and bias against the very activity described in the article. Anarchangel 08:20, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

After the prod tag, I was pretty annoyed, and so was quite zealous in my small fit of madness. After that was over I was going to pull out, but your comment raised some extra thought on the matter. I will still accept it if an administrator decides that it truly must be deleted, but I nonetheless appreciate your intervention, and thank you for help. --Draenoch 09:11, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

The tag has already been removed because the article was modified and the tag challenged. It's certainly better than it was although I'm still not 100% sure it couldn't be combined with other ideas. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 09:45, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

I still think it's pretty much pointless. I mean, (and this should really be the golden rule regarding roleplaying pages), you have to ask yourself, would anyone really do this? Can you actually look at this (and many of the other RP articles, I'm not just singling you out here, because I think the vast majority of these articles are relatively pointless) and say "Gosh, that'd be a fun thing to do with my time."? Would you really just walk around the graveyard, pretend that you can dig holes and put bodies in them, randomly go to the houses of the "deceased" and pretend to break the bad news to them and console them? None of these things are possible in the game. Everything else just amounts to "put some dark somber clothes on" and use your imagination - in which :case I say "Why are you even playing this game?" There's nothing in this that really involves the game itself, it's basically just an imagination-trip, which you could do just as easily without playing the game. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 12:15, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

I'm not disagreeing with you - I'm just pointing out that because of the reasons I stated it's no longer correct to use a Proposed Deletion tag - you'll have to start a deletion review instead. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 13:21, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Can i suggest that a note is added to the Guidelines for Contributions section of the main roleplaying page which as Lurlock points out, encourages people to think about what is actually possible in oblivion? There seem to have been too many articles recently which have had this problem. --Volanaro 14:08, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

As a matter of fact, I've recently proposed a few new guidelines on the Roleplaying talk page if anyone wants to comment on those. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 14:46, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Indeed, I don't really care what happens to this article. You seem to be, or have been, under the impression that I am defending it at all costs. No. I wrote this article out of a spur-the-moment attitude. I leave it up to the majority to decide whether they want to read it or what. Yet at the same time an aggressive stance from your view isn't necessarily in order. Yes, you may find it useless, and so may many others. In that case, perhaps you should get some form of consensus on the matter; get more people to call it useless, and, ultimately, have it deleted. I do not believe that attacking it on your own is the way to go about this. But, as said previously, if you really believe that it should be deleted, then replace the deletion tag and see if someone argues against it. In any case, isn't roleplaying itself an imagination-trip? Roleplaying via Oblivion is just doing something that you could do playing D&D. It doesn't really fit in your argument to try and use that.

But try not make it so cynical. It doesn't do you any favors. Draenoch 06:38, 13 July 2008 (EDT)

• NOTE: the above discussion will be treated as one Delete votes (TheRealLurlock), one Keep vote (Anarchangel) and one Neutral vote (Draenoch). If anybody thinks those choices are unfair or inaccurate, please reply here. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 01:13, 25 October 2008 (EDT)

• Delete: Mostly not possible and the remainder would be incredibly dull. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 01:13, 25 October 2008 (EDT)